2011-10-01T12:07:04  <willkg> config supybot.plugins.ChannelLogger.enable True
2011-10-01T12:07:08  <willkg> gmgbot`: config supybot.plugins.ChannelLogger.enable True
2011-10-01T12:07:08  <gmgbot`> willkg: The operation succeeded.
2011-10-01T12:07:12  <paroneayea> horray
2011-10-01T12:07:12  <willkg> apparently.
2011-10-01T12:07:14  <paroneayea> okay
2011-10-01T12:07:16  <willkg> i'll fix the wiki page.
2011-10-01T12:07:23  <paroneayea> so if we ARE going to do a meeting this week and one next week
2011-10-01T12:07:41  <paroneayea> and if things *did* fall asleep this last month largely due to me getting hit by a life-load bus ;)
2011-10-01T12:07:53  <paroneayea> maybe what we should focus on right here is our caffeine injection
2011-10-01T12:07:56  <paroneayea> to wake things back up
2011-10-01T12:08:12  <Elrond> Yep.
2011-10-01T12:08:24  * paroneayea having trouble figuring out how to run a meeting about a meeting, so let's maybe ignore that aspect for now?
2011-10-01T12:08:25  <Elrond> UX testing was a success last month, IMHO!
2011-10-01T12:08:35  <paroneayea> isn't meeting about meetings a big cliche? ;)
2011-10-01T12:08:37  <paroneayea> Elrond: yes!
2011-10-01T12:08:39  <paroneayea> I think so
2011-10-01T12:08:51  <paroneayea> we also have a bunch of things that are soooo close to wrapping up
2011-10-01T12:08:53  <paroneayea> eg, caching
2011-10-01T12:09:05  <paroneayea> nyergler has CSRF stuff that just needs test fixing
2011-10-01T12:09:18  <Elrond> Ahh, great.
2011-10-01T12:09:50  <paroneayea> the one thing that we missed out on the most this month I think is that we didn't make any progress on the website... willkg and I have discussed sprinting on that this weekend
2011-10-01T12:09:57  <paroneayea> so the topics here seem to be
2011-10-01T12:10:18  <paroneayea>  - 0.1.0 release
2011-10-01T12:10:19  <paroneayea>  - wrapping things up and re-waking our community up
2011-10-01T12:10:19  <paroneayea>  - the website
2011-10-01T12:10:26  <paroneayea> those first two being highly related.
2011-10-01T12:11:04  <paroneayea> we could do a 0.1.0 release right now.  freedeb and I talked about we'll have the 0.1.0 p;ost talk about what we've accomplished so far between starting and 0.1.0, which is a *lot* actually
2011-10-01T12:11:11  <Elrond> This first has a subpoint: When to release? When some important things are in, or just "soon"?
2011-10-01T12:11:37  <paroneayea> Elrond: I'd say either sunday night / monday morning, or next weekend.
2011-10-01T12:11:39  *** TheAncientGoat has joined #mediagoblin
2011-10-01T12:11:57  <paroneayea> that's a call about whether or not we're willing to extend things or if we need to push on things all at once
2011-10-01T12:12:14  <paroneayea> extending things puts us down a slippery slope of not meeting monthly releases so well :)
2011-10-01T12:12:20  <paroneayea> but not extending it means a less exciting release.
2011-10-01T12:12:25  <Elrond> Is there anything *important* missing from 0.1.0 just "now"?
2011-10-01T12:12:40  <paroneayea> Elrond: nothing critical really
2011-10-01T12:12:53  <paroneayea> we even considered 0.0.5 being 0.1.0
2011-10-01T12:12:57  <paroneayea> so in that sense we're pretty okay
2011-10-01T12:13:00  <nyergler> some releases are exciting, some are not; if we tell "users" that we're releasing monthly, we should do so
2011-10-01T12:13:10  <paroneayea> nyergler has spoken ;)
2011-10-01T12:13:13  <paroneayea> okay.
2011-10-01T12:13:14  <nyergler> nothing prevents a dot-release mid-way through if we *really* need to get things out the door :)
2011-10-01T12:13:20  <Elrond> Yeah.
2011-10-01T12:13:22  <paroneayea> so it's decided!
2011-10-01T12:13:28  <paroneayea> we'll release sunday night / blog monday morning
2011-10-01T12:13:32  <Elrond> The release notes might contain a section on "what's missing". :-)
2011-10-01T12:13:38  <paroneayea> ;)
2011-10-01T12:13:41  <nyergler> Or "what's next" :)
2011-10-01T12:13:47  <paroneayea> yes
2011-10-01T12:13:49  <Elrond> nyergler - Yeah!
2011-10-01T12:13:54  <Elrond> More positive!
2011-10-01T12:13:56  <paroneayea> so we'll just sprint on what we can
2011-10-01T12:14:00  <nyergler> ("Did you miss work yesterday?" "I wouldn't say I _missed_ it")
2011-10-01T12:14:05  <paroneayea> and what we can't oh well, that's exciting 0.1.1 material!
2011-10-01T12:14:10  <paroneayea> nyergler: ;)
2011-10-01T12:14:23  <paroneayea> I'm feeling positive already :)
2011-10-01T12:14:31  <Elrond> So "CSRF is coming very soon after 0.1.0" ;-))
2011-10-01T12:14:45  <paroneayea> that can be the "on the horizon" end of the post.
2011-10-01T12:14:48  <paroneayea> yeah
2011-10-01T12:14:49  <paroneayea> okay
2011-10-01T12:14:55  <Elrond> I like that.
2011-10-01T12:15:19  <Elrond> We don't need to be "super secure", but having it security on the horizon is great.
2011-10-01T12:15:24  <paroneayea> right
2011-10-01T12:15:34  <paroneayea> so I'll focus on:
2011-10-01T12:15:34  <paroneayea>  - fixing straggler issues in the design
2011-10-01T12:15:34  <paroneayea>  - writing up a blogpost outline for freedeb to flesh out
2011-10-01T12:15:34  <paroneayea>  - maybe start working on website stuff
2011-10-01T12:16:00  <schendje> I can join you for two of those :)
2011-10-01T12:16:08  <paroneayea> SCHENDJE!!!
2011-10-01T12:16:10  <Elrond> schendje! :-)
2011-10-01T12:16:11  <paroneayea> :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
2011-10-01T12:16:20  <paroneayea> that was epic timing
2011-10-01T12:16:21  <schendje> hi guys :)
2011-10-01T12:16:31  <schendje> nah, I knew about the meeting ;)
2011-10-01T12:16:36  <paroneayea> it's like we were having some roundtable discussion about how to attack the enemy fortress
2011-10-01T12:16:44  <paroneayea> and we were like "if only we had a magic user"
2011-10-01T12:16:57  <paroneayea> and the token magic hero steps from the shadwos and said "I can help with that."
2011-10-01T12:17:06  <paroneayea> and everyone stares slack-jawed
2011-10-01T12:17:12  <paroneayea> schendje: welcome back :D
2011-10-01T12:17:20  <schendje> paroneayea: haha, thanks!
2011-10-01T12:17:43  <paroneayea> okay, this meeting is going great enough, I don't think we need to have a meeting about meetings
2011-10-01T12:17:45  <paroneayea> I"ve declared it
2011-10-01T12:17:50  <paroneayea> so let's just discuss what we're doing.
2011-10-01T12:18:00  <Elrond> Yep.
2011-10-01T12:18:03  <paroneayea> schendje: what do you need from me at this point?
2011-10-01T12:18:13  <schendje> paroneayea: not much, I think I can work on the website tomorrow?
2011-10-01T12:18:19  <paroneayea> schendje: stellar.
2011-10-01T12:18:25  <schendje> it'd be nice if you can answer questions when they pop up
2011-10-01T12:18:31  <paroneayea> I'll be around all day tomorrow.
2011-10-01T12:18:41  <schendje> excellent, then we can work on that together
2011-10-01T12:18:45  <paroneayea> yes!
2011-10-01T12:19:13  <paroneayea> so today I'll work on straggler issues, and I'll work on the outline, and whatever elrond pesters me with probably ;)
2011-10-01T12:19:24  <paroneayea> and then tomorrow the site design and whatever's appropriate for wrapping things up
2011-10-01T12:19:26  <Elrond> ;-)
2011-10-01T12:19:39  <paroneayea> willkg said he can help out with the pyblosxom structural stuff on a previous conversation
2011-10-01T12:19:43  <willkg> bd
2011-10-01T12:20:06  <paroneayea> stellar!
2011-10-01T12:20:17  <paroneayea> so, weekend plan in place.  Do we need to talk much about next month's features?
2011-10-01T12:20:23  <paroneayea> we have a pretty good list of things to work on already I think.
2011-10-01T12:20:32  <paroneayea> if people want to bring up new ones though
2011-10-01T12:21:01  <Elrond> Hmm.
2011-10-01T12:21:44  <Elrond> We could decide on priorities for next month?
2011-10-01T12:21:53  <paroneayea> yes
2011-10-01T12:21:53  <Elrond> AND: Do we want to continue monthly releases?
2011-10-01T12:22:11  <paroneayea> I think as willkg has said correctly, the monthly releases are the heart of the project
2011-10-01T12:22:18  <paroneayea> if anything, we had a murmur this month
2011-10-01T12:22:23  <willkg> heartbeat--not the heart.
2011-10-01T12:22:27  <willkg> people are the heart of the project.
2011-10-01T12:22:27  <paroneayea> didn't quite skip a beat
2011-10-01T12:22:29  <paroneayea> right
2011-10-01T12:22:31  <paroneayea> that's what I meant to say
2011-10-01T12:22:39  <paroneayea> so I think it's still useful
2011-10-01T12:22:46  <Elrond> Yep.
2011-10-01T12:22:51  <paroneayea> the fact that I freaked out so much about this month not being as amazing awesome as last one
2011-10-01T12:22:55  <Elrond> We're still officialy alpha? beta? Right?
2011-10-01T12:22:59  <paroneayea> has helped put me put myself back on track at least
2011-10-01T12:23:25  <paroneayea> hm, I think we're alpha or beta
2011-10-01T12:23:27  <paroneayea> probably more alpha :)
2011-10-01T12:23:29  <paroneayea> but I don't know
2011-10-01T12:23:35  <paroneayea> we're starting to get pretty well featured.
2011-10-01T12:23:40  <Elrond> Okay, so monthly releases are fine!
2011-10-01T12:23:43  <paroneayea> yes
2011-10-01T12:23:46  <paroneayea> monthly releases are great
2011-10-01T12:23:46  <schendje> I'd like to get the language selecting thing sorted out
2011-10-01T12:23:47  <nyergler> concur
2011-10-01T12:24:00  <paroneayea> schendje: okay yes let's discuss that
2011-10-01T12:24:02  <schendje> since we've got the translations, but no way to really use them properly
2011-10-01T12:24:05  <nyergler> as long as things are landing in master, we should ship regularly
2011-10-01T12:24:05  <Elrond> schendje - You mena for next month?
2011-10-01T12:24:13  <schendje> Elrond: yes
2011-10-01T12:24:26  <nyergler> schendje: you mean selecting a locale (other than what ever is negotiated with the browser)
2011-10-01T12:24:31  <nyergler> right?
2011-10-01T12:24:37  <schendje> nyergler: yes :)
2011-10-01T12:24:59  <paroneayea> there are four options for that I think
2011-10-01T12:25:03  <paroneayea>  - leave it as is ;)
2011-10-01T12:25:17  <paroneayea>  - put it in user profiles (this only helps logged in users though)
2011-10-01T12:25:24  <paroneayea>  - put it glaringly somewhere in the design
2011-10-01T12:25:51  <paroneayea>  - put it sneakily somewhere in the design... ie a dropdown in the upper-right like on google's "black bar" or the old miro guide design which I can't pull up because they killed it ;)
2011-10-01T12:26:00  <schendje> what's the current behavior? automatic detection or something?
2011-10-01T12:26:08  <paroneayea> schendje: yes uses browser settings
2011-10-01T12:26:15  <schendje> cool
2011-10-01T12:26:18  <paroneayea> whatever your language settings are, it uses
2011-10-01T12:26:19  <paroneayea> you can also do
2011-10-01T12:26:23  <paroneayea> ?lang=foo
2011-10-01T12:26:30  <paroneayea> nobody knows about htat though and it's not persistent ;)
2011-10-01T12:26:44  <schendje> nah, but it's interesting for us at least :)
2011-10-01T12:26:48  <nyergler> and those options aren't all mutually exclusive -- you could sneak it into the footer of the page design and also allow users to set it at the account level
2011-10-01T12:27:05  <paroneayea> schendje: do you have preferences?
2011-10-01T12:27:08  <paroneayea> nyergler: right
2011-10-01T12:27:17  <paroneayea> I think regardless we should have a user preference option.
2011-10-01T12:27:30  <schendje> paroneayea: haven't thought about it that much yet. some of those options I like better, but not sure yet
2011-10-01T12:27:31  <Elrond> Yes.
2011-10-01T12:27:40  <schendje> we can make something good though, I'm sure of that
2011-10-01T12:27:43  <paroneayea> user preference is also low hanging fruit
2011-10-01T12:27:49  <paroneayea> so we should maybe tackle that first
2011-10-01T12:27:55  <paroneayea> and then let schendje figure out where he wants it
2011-10-01T12:28:00  * schendje -> dinner time, sorry! will read up and respond later
2011-10-01T12:28:05  <paroneayea> sure thing
2011-10-01T12:28:17  <paroneayea> look forward to a day of beautifulness with you tomorrow schendje !
2011-10-01T12:28:23  <paroneayea> we will make mediagoblin.org look great :)
2011-10-01T12:29:05  <paroneayea> okay so that sounds like a plan... action item is we should update that ticket.. looking for it now :)
2011-10-01T12:29:10  <Elrond> I like that. User option, then GUI option. :-)
2011-10-01T12:29:28  <AVRS> Wikimedia uses ?uselang and preferences. But I guess it works because most non-logged in users come to non-language-specific projects from a Wikipedia.
2011-10-01T12:29:35  <paroneayea> AVRS: right
2011-10-01T12:29:38  <AVRS> (which creates uselang)
2011-10-01T12:30:18  <paroneayea> I'm updating that ticket now
2011-10-01T12:30:22  <paroneayea> anything else to discuss?
2011-10-01T12:30:45  <gullydwarf> what's the word on federation these days?
2011-10-01T12:30:55  <paroneayea> gullydwarf!
2011-10-01T12:31:03  <Elrond> I have some buglets, I want to see squashed after 0.1.0. I'll see on that on my own.
2011-10-01T12:31:05  <paroneayea> everyone's coming back for maximum awesome :)
2011-10-01T12:31:10  <gullydwarf> hey!
2011-10-01T12:31:15  <paroneayea> gullydwarf: that was to be something we prioritize for post 0.1.0
2011-10-01T12:31:16  <paroneayea> so!
2011-10-01T12:31:25  <paroneayea> now might be a good time to start putting those wheels into spinning
2011-10-01T12:31:28  *** Artopal has joined #mediagoblin
2011-10-01T12:31:42  <Elrond> Yeah.
2011-10-01T12:32:06  <paroneayea> now that the "core" is starting to solidify, the three big exciting things on the horizon are multiple media types (in progress via joar), federation, an API
2011-10-01T12:32:13  <Elrond> Welcome Artopal! We're just having our monthly meeting. :)
2011-10-01T12:32:19  <paroneayea> yes welcome Artopal :)
2011-10-01T12:32:20  <Elrond> (which is logged)
2011-10-01T12:32:41  <paroneayea> nobody's really claimed federation, though I want to start talking about it more and researching it more before we completely jump in
2011-10-01T12:32:56  <paroneayea> but it looks like there are no good general purpose ostatus libraries
2011-10-01T12:33:04  <paroneayea> I've been thinking that instead of tangling it directly with mediagoblin
2011-10-01T12:33:13  <paroneayea> WE should make the ostatus library for python ;)
2011-10-01T12:33:19  <gullydwarf> oooh
2011-10-01T12:33:20  <Elrond> Okay, so this month: Talking about federation!
2011-10-01T12:33:25  <paroneayea> yes
2011-10-01T12:33:33  <gullydwarf> WE...oooh
2011-10-01T12:33:48  <paroneayea> as a separate project, either under the LGPL or apache
2011-10-01T12:33:53  <Artopal> Hi all!
2011-10-01T12:33:54  <Elrond> We should have some idea, how federation should look like, etc!
2011-10-01T12:33:57  <gullydwarf> awesome
2011-10-01T12:34:20  <gullydwarf> heya Artopal
2011-10-01T12:34:20  <paroneayea> I'm not too sure about how useful the LGPL is for python libraries, I lean more towards apache stuff, but I know the FSF likes LGPL
2011-10-01T12:34:25  <paroneayea> I tend to think we should just do apache
2011-10-01T12:34:32  <AVRS> We now have a wiki page for ideas: http://wiki.mediagoblin.org/Feature_Ideas
2011-10-01T12:34:33  <paroneayea> it'll be good for wider adoption in the python community
2011-10-01T12:34:39  <paroneayea> oh right
2011-10-01T12:34:45  <paroneayea> AVRS: that's a feature to mention on the blogpost
2011-10-01T12:34:56  <paroneayea> a feature about features
2011-10-01T12:35:08  <paroneayea> gullydwarf: as for what to start doing
2011-10-01T12:35:18  <paroneayea> zcopley suggested we start on activity streams first
2011-10-01T12:35:31  <paroneayea> http://activitystrea.ms/
2011-10-01T12:35:53  *** Jarrhead has quit IRC
2011-10-01T12:35:53  <Elrond> Yep. webfinger and stuff are mostly easy.
2011-10-01T12:36:14  <paroneayea> so we search out if any of these are provided by generic libraries, but if not we start our own library for them
2011-10-01T12:36:18  <paroneayea> which means we need a name ;)
2011-10-01T12:36:31  <gullydwarf> why activity streams first?
2011-10-01T12:36:44  <Elrond> gullydwarf - They are simple, low hanging fruits. ;)
2011-10-01T12:36:55  <paroneayea> gullydwarf: because it makes us readable
2011-10-01T12:37:01  <paroneayea> and because zcopley said so ;)
2011-10-01T12:37:04  <Elrond> libgmg ;o)
2011-10-01T12:37:12  <paroneayea> Elrond: goblinhorde
2011-10-01T12:37:13  <paroneayea> ;)
2011-10-01T12:37:14  <paroneayea> haha
2011-10-01T12:37:17  * gullydwarf nods
2011-10-01T12:37:30  <Elrond> libgoblin
2011-10-01T12:37:38  <paroneayea> I think we should try to trick zcopley into spilling all his federation secrets into #mediagoblin this month ;)
2011-10-01T12:37:57  <paroneayea> (federation secrets an oxymoron?)
2011-10-01T12:38:10  <gullydwarf> paroneayea: :)
2011-10-01T12:38:43  <Elrond> libgobelin! ;o)  (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gobelins_Manufactory )
2011-10-01T12:38:56  <paroneayea> "horde" an untaken python library name, and short :)
2011-10-01T12:38:58  <paroneayea> hm
2011-10-01T12:39:04  <gullydwarf> lair?
2011-10-01T12:39:15  <paroneayea> it should have something to do with noise
2011-10-01T12:39:20  <paroneayea> noisiness, communication
2011-10-01T12:39:24  <paroneayea> hordevoice
2011-10-01T12:39:28  <paroneayea> okay I'll drop horde ;)
2011-10-01T12:39:45  <paroneayea> Elrond: "gobelin" is funny, potentially confusing to contributors
2011-10-01T12:40:11  <gullydwarf> gobs
2011-10-01T12:40:18  <paroneayea> I think "libgoblin" is fun but doesn't say "federation", it says "general [media]goblin utilities"
2011-10-01T12:40:31  <Elrond> Yep.
2011-10-01T12:40:36  <paroneayea> is there some sort of fun communication machine
2011-10-01T12:40:45  <AVRS> libgoblins ;)
2011-10-01T12:40:46  <Elrond> gobelin is a bit about communcation, in an obscure way. ;)
2011-10-01T12:40:48  <gullydwarf> tin cans and string...
2011-10-01T12:40:53  <paroneayea> telegraph?
2011-10-01T12:40:57  <willkg> iphones?
2011-10-01T12:41:01  <paroneayea> untaken as a python library
2011-10-01T12:41:07  * paroneayea /kicks willkg ;)
2011-10-01T12:41:17  <gullydwarf> semiphore!
2011-10-01T12:41:45  <paroneayea> gullydwarf: hm I think people will assume that's a locking library
2011-10-01T12:42:15  <Elrond> Hmm, something about communication that would be found in a goblin world.
2011-10-01T12:42:27  <gullydwarf> smoke signals...
2011-10-01T12:42:39  <gullydwarf> whale song
2011-10-01T12:43:04  * Elrond loves those tele slugs from one piece. ;o)
2011-10-01T12:43:19  <willkg> i need to get going....  is there anything else we need to cover other than naming a library?
2011-10-01T12:43:35  <Elrond> willkg - *duck* bus factor. ;)
2011-10-01T12:43:41  <paroneayea> yes bus factor :)
2011-10-01T12:44:00  <paroneayea> I'm not sure what can be done about that for now other than me to ask other people to step forward on some of this
2011-10-01T12:44:08  <paroneayea> and maybe also to give out commit access to some of the core people
2011-10-01T12:44:28  <paroneayea> the latter is trickyish, but maybe it's time
2011-10-01T12:44:46  <paroneayea> it's been helpful I think with me reviewing everything pedantically before merging :)
2011-10-01T12:44:46  <willkg> what is it we're blocking on?  things getting done?  things getting checked in?  or things getting decided?
2011-10-01T12:44:48  <nyergler> paroneayea: it's only tricky if you believe it is: after all, it's version control, you can always revert :)
2011-10-01T12:44:49  *** tian2992 has joined #mediagoblin
2011-10-01T12:44:58  <Elrond> I don't know either, what to do. But I think, we should have a bit of time thinking about it.
2011-10-01T12:45:01  <paroneayea> nyergler: hm that's true
2011-10-01T12:45:03  <paroneayea> okay
2011-10-01T12:45:07  <paroneayea> maybe we should jsut say
2011-10-01T12:45:13  <paroneayea> that's an ongoing topic for this month
2011-10-01T12:45:18  <paroneayea> let's keep talking about it in-channel
2011-10-01T12:45:21  <nyergler> b
2011-10-01T12:45:24  <paroneayea> along with a library name
2011-10-01T12:45:25  <willkg> i think the only issue is things getting decided.
2011-10-01T12:45:35  <willkg> everything is alleviated because of distributed version control.
2011-10-01T12:45:58  <paroneayea> it sounds like willkg needs to go, and I think we have generally some time to talk this through
2011-10-01T12:46:06  <paroneayea> let's make this channel noisy again this month
2011-10-01T12:46:08  <paroneayea> is one goal :)
2011-10-01T12:46:16  <Elrond> Yeah.
2011-10-01T12:46:25  <nyergler> ok, i'm going to duck out, too, be back online and working in an hour or two
2011-10-01T12:46:31  <paroneayea> cool
2011-10-01T12:46:32  <Elrond> I don't think, the blocking factor is very "specific", but maybe a "noisy" thing. :)
2011-10-01T12:46:40  <paroneayea> I should duck out soon too
2011-10-01T12:46:44  <paroneayea> have to head to the bank
2011-10-01T12:46:47  <paroneayea> meeting over I think!
2011-10-01T12:46:55  <Elrond> Yep.
2011-10-01T12:46:59  <willkg> ok.  i'm going to shut off logging now.
2011-10-01T12:47:03  <paroneayea> great :)
2011-10-01T12:47:04  <gullydwarf> cool
2011-10-01T12:47:10  <paroneayea> and I should be around this month unlike last one